RE: Anthony's Post

I agree with what Anthony is saying about the relationship between Mel and Terri. Their relation will not last much longer, but what about other relations just like this in the U.S? Today, most relations could be seen just like Mel and Terri's, how they were drawn physically to each other and now have no love in between them. We cannot say for certain that these kind of false relations will cease, but the point is that we must recognize what can be considered as a poor relation compared to a meaningful relation. Relationships like Mel and Terri's is a wrap on the whole concept of marriage and how nowadays we only marry what we see.

In response to Nicole's blog...

In response to Nicole's blog...

Nicole mentioned a lot of things about the difference between the two versions of the story... I'd like to add one... The titles. Why do you think Carver's editor changed the title from "Beginners" to "What We Talk About When We Talk About Love"? I think that there's a huge difference between the two titles. For one, "Beginners", to me, is a description and/or reflection of the level of love and level of comprehension of love the four main characters have and experience. I think it's interesting how this group is one of adults and in fact they are beginners with love, especially juxtaposed against the old couple who is 70 years old, and have developed and maintained a sense of true love. I guess even when we become adults, we aren't experienced or even good at a lot of things, such as love. The other title, "What We Talk About When We Talk About Love" is more general, i feel. It's more intriguing but more superficial. Then again, i think it's appropriate since a lot of the original story was cut away by Carver's editor. The title makes me think - which i like - and it still holds some of the same insight as "Beginners" since the reader has to ask oneself 'What DO we talk about when we talk about love??' Love is different for everyone and I think that point is proven in both of Carver's versions, though the versions are indeed different and thus the titles reflect the stories in different ways.

What We Talk about when we talk about love

In the short story "What we talk about when we talk about love" i thought that it was ironic how the whole story Terri, and Mel were talking about love, they were almost rude to each other. The kept saying what love meant to each of them, but the almost disagreed about everything. How can someone married for 5 years still be together if the meaning of love is so different to each of them. This goes back to the other couple Nick and Laura and how they are still in the lovey dovey stage of there marriage because they almost agree about everything in the story. I feel that Mel and Terri dont really love each other anymore, i think that Terri is just scared to find someone new because of her previous love affair. Mel i think is in love with the idea that he is in love. I dont think there marriage will last much longer!

- ~~~~afb ~~~~~

Four types of Love

I found "What we Talk About When We Talk About Love" to be an interesting portrayal of four different types of "love" relationships. These include the abusive and obsessive love of Ed and Terri, the diminishing and faded love of Mel and Terri, the honeymoon love of Laura and Nick, and the profound and sincere love of the old couple in the accident. The story intricately described the dynamics of each of these forms of love. I believe that Raymond Carver was attempting to juxtapose negative forms of love with positive ones by creating two positive relationships and two negative ones. Overall I found the comparison to be intriguing.

What we talk about when we talk about love?

I really thought that I could relate to this short story because of what relationships mean to us nowadays. Relationships are, as I see it, made in a sort of artificial sense. For instance, maybe some relationships would seem like they would last forever, like a high school sweetheart relationship, but in reality they are fake. In the story, liquor dictates the relationship between Mel and Terri by revealing that their relationship is very poor, mainly focusing on abusive behavior, especially when Ed adds to their negative relationship. From what I can see, relationship cannot be made overnight; relationships have to be worked on constantly. Sometimes this would take many years of wisdom before a relationship is perfect. That is why the old couple's relationship is by far the strongest of the ones discussed in the story because they are true to themselves. Our generation has to relate to this story whenever we are in a relation with another person because those bonds are the most important connections we will ever have in life.

How to Talk to a Hunter

I really liked reading this story both because of its humor and also because of the style that is has been written in. This is one of the few stories I've read which addresses the reader with the pronoun, "you". I feel that this is an aspect which draws the reader into the emotional dilemma of the nameless protagonist, and makes her story seem very real. I also liked how Houston contrasts the hunter and protagonist with recognizable pop culture references like the Janis Joplin song lyrics "freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose" and the Willie Nelson song. The best male friend and best female friend are also believable as different sources of advice for the protagonist; I could almost picture people I know saying the same things about a relationship like this. Overall, I thought it was an engaging and realistic read on modern day relationships.

What we talk about when we talk about love and Beginners

I thought it was really interesting to read both versions of this story. The unedited version, "Beginners" seems more complete, but it also seems like a different story. The story told about the old couple in the accident is much longer in "Beginners". It is more obvious that their story is about true love. Their story is the center of "Beginners" because it portrays the only real love in the story. The old man is obviously in love with his life in the edited version, but his love is shown through his actions in "Beginners". He shaves and lotions before going to see his wife after the accident. When he kisses her hand, she beings crying uncontrollably. I think this is the moment that captivates the couple's pure love. In the edited version, their love is shown by the devastation the man feels when he can't see his wife, but the unedited version of the old couple seems more realistic. Many things are explained by Carver in the unedited version, like Terri's true feelings about Carl. Near the end, we find out that Terri was pregnant and had an abortion, which she feels bad about. I think both stories do a good job of explaining the different topics of love, and their success and failures, but they seem like different stories. "Beginners" gives a complete, detailed explanation of the topics of love, with true love being the main focus.